"A generation that in itself forgotten what it means to be citizens, becoming merely consumers"
A down-to-earth conversation about ESG and Brazil with impact strategist Ítala Herta.
By Verena Pessim | March 7, 2025
Photos by: Arthur Nobre/MM
I strongly believe in collective action. We urgently need to form a resistance collective that embraces diverse, inclusive thinking and positions Brazil as a leader in global impact discussions, especially since we face so many social and environmental challenges of our own.
And I don’t say this to exclude international discussions, on the contrary, we need to build more internal alliances: between regions of Brazil, the suburbs and city centers, along with strengthening our Latin American brotherhood and forging external alliances with the rest of the world.
As actress Fernanda Torres put it through many interviews during this Oscar and Golden Globe season while Brazil was being showcased globally, "Brazil can't be an island just because we speak Portuguese among Spanish-speaking countries.” We produce so much in terms of culture, design and technology, and the bridges between us need to be built and strengthened.
And this is exactly from where our guest, Ítala Herta, began our conversation with. According to her, "It’s important to recognize who will speak on doing something for the country, regardless of ideological decisions and speculation from other nations."
About our interviewee
With over 15 years of experience in social innovation, impact, and creative economy, Ítala has centered her work on the intersections of diversity, equity, and inclusion in Brazil. She is the co-founder of Vale do Dendê, where she organized the Afro Futurista Festival and launched Brazil's first Afro-entrepreneurship accelerator in the Northeast region.
In 2020, she founded DIVER.SSA, a platform dedicated to the emotional and mental well-being of women entrepreneurs. A 2019 IVLP (International Visitor Leadership Program) alumna, Ítala was one of the eight Brazilian leaders invited to participate in the U.S. Department of State’s professional exchange program, which took her through six U.S. cities. She was also named one of the 50 most creative people in Brazil by Wired Magazine. She serves on Ambev’s Diversity Committee and is a leader at Mesa.
After such an inspiring introduction, I leave you with quotes and passages from this incredible conversation. I hope it inspires you too!
Brazil and ESG
Verena (Meio): How would you explain ESG to someone who's not familiar with it?
Ítala: Before we merge these three bigger topics into an acronym, we need to ask ourselves: What do sustainability, governance, and social responsibility mean to you? These fancy English words are really just things you're already doing, and they sum up the meaning of ESG. It's important to contextualize the acronyms and avoid using English in particular environments while having the humility to explain what they really means. The most intuitive, efficient, and simple approach is often the most revolutionary one. We need to be able to answer this question to a 70-year-old woman from a local community.
Verena (Meio): What’s your perspective on ESG and Brazil?
Ítala: During an international experience with the Belgian Embassy during an economic mission in Brazil, I emphasized that we wouldn’t be teaching something we didn’t already know, nor would we be hearing anything unfamiliar. Brazil has the intelligence, creativity, and challenges that allow us to prototype solutions in a unique way. Brazilians are skilled at adapting things to their own realities, but this ability is still lacking in corporate settings.
Verena (Meio): And why do you think that is?
Ítala: Brazil is often portrayed as a market that needs to be helped: as a poor country in need of development. People want to support us, but they forget that we are the protagonists of our own story. Some incredible professionals may not have attended top business schools but instead created real solutions for their settings. Yet, these voices are rarely included in the conversation. We don’t invest in them, we don’t create space for them, and we don’t listen to these marginalized forms of intelligence. We discredit what has already been done, and brands often want to start from scratch, which is a huge mistake. There’s a real struggle to recognize and value authorship.
We empathize with tragedies around the world, yet often overlook the realities unfolding right next to us. We need to truly acknowledge our own context and challenges. The solutions and experts are already here; they just need access to the right spaces and support to develop their talent. We must recognize who is stepping up and taking action for the country, regardless of ideological debates or external influences.
“Brazil has the intelligence, creativity, and challenges that allow us to prototype solutions in a unique way. Brazilians are skilled at adapting things to their own realities, but this ability is still lacking in corporate settings.”
- Ítala Herta
Brands, the government, and individuals within this context.
Verena (Meio): How do you view the role of brands and individuals in this matter?
Ítala: One part of society is driving change, regardless of who is in power. Another within the private sector is often influenced by ideological speculation, making decision-making more uncertain. With so many different interests, hesitation takes over. But the private sector is also part of society and must share responsibility. Take a moment to reflect on who you are and where you stand: beyond being a consumer.
Verena (Meio): What are your overall observations?
Ítala: Here lies a generation that in itself forgotten what it means to be citizens, becoming merely consumers. Still, we’re waking up. Companies are falling short, and we’ll need legal frameworks. Corporate leaders must engage with the public sector and mediate conflicts. Dialogue is the most important tool. The public sector also needs to be ready to collaborate with the private sector. As things converge, these conversations will be essential.
Verena (Meio): And how do you perceive the relationship between the private sector and governments, particularly those with far-right ideologies?
Ítala: There’s a paradox with the rise of right-wing governments. While it may be a privilege to avoid difficult conversations, it’s equally important to build bridges with them, seeking paths within legal frameworks and through international cooperation with countries that don’t share this ideology. There are international agencies and global funds available, but what’s missing is the effort and courage to pursue these partnerships. Political isolation could occur, which would be disastrous for the economy. We need to stop reacting and start focusing on prevention.
Verena (Meio): How do you view the issue of prevention versus reactivity within companies?
Ítala: Many companies tend to react instead of focusing on prevention. While they allocate budget for managing image crises, they lack funding for research and proactive strategies. This leads to wasted resources and inconsistent actions. Investing in education from an early age is crucial for fostering excellence. Money alone doesn’t solve everything; relationships, trust, and intelligence are equally important.
What can we do, and who are the leading figures in this movement?
Verena (Meio): What actions can people take into practice?
Ítala: It’s not just about what we can do, but also about what we can stop consuming, accepting, or agreeing with. It’s about making conscious decisions regarding our impact on the world around us. Women, especially Black and Indigenous women, are often excluded from these conversations and need to be at the forefront and making informed decisions. There are ways to address the tensions that are essential for driving change. I don’t have to spend all my time worrying about polarization; I need to learn how to navigate it and actively contribute to it. We must challenge those with the power and privilege to avoid these discussions and hold them accountable.
“It’s not just about what we can do, but also about what we can stop consuming, accepting, or agreeing with. It’s about making conscious decisions regarding our impact on the world around us.”
Ítala Herta
Verena (Meio): In terms of consumption, what can we do?
Ítala: Capitalism displaces, strips away identity, and makes us forget who we are. If we forget that we have the power to make decisions, we will fail to take action for ourselves. There’s much to be done, from decisions about consumption to staying consistent in our conversations. Deciding not to laugh at or ignore racist, sexist or transphobic comments is a crucial step. It’s exhausting, but we must become the majority and learn to address these behaviors or redirect them to the proper channels. Every act of exclusion or discrimination should be met with accountability.
Verena (Meio): Who are the leading figures in this movement of conscious citizens?
Ítala: Brazil’s black women’s movement is one of the most successful in the world. Sueli Carneiro and other activists have developed policies and actions that transformed the country. The intellectual capital from Brazil’s traditional and popular communities, The Brazilian academy, sociologists, philosophers, social scientists, and researchers are making a significant difference. Our healthcare system is one of the most well-structured in the world. Many people, not just those with large followers, have been driving change for a long time by now.
Verena (Meio): What’s lacking, then?
Ítala: People often forget that the wealthiest countries invested heavily in research, education, and economic reparations. We need to develop a model for wealth distributio, not just in monetary terms, but also through access, dignity, and rights. My role models are those who govern without relying on money, facing difficult conversations head-on. The solution for our country isn’t solely entrepreneurship, but understanding citizenship. We need to reflect on our roles as citizens and as part of society. Psychological and emotional support is crucial, as entrepreneurship is challenging. Additionally, we need fair tax reform and, above all, to eliminate poverty, which will also help reduce informality.
“Brazil’s black women’s movement is one of the most successful in the world. Sueli Carneiro and other activists have developed policies and actions that transformed the country.“
- Ítala Herta.
In the photo: Sueli Carneiro.
DIVER.SSA - emotional and mental well-being of women entrepreneurs.
Verena (Meio): Could you talk about DIVER.SSA?
Ítala: DIVER.SSA was born out of urgency. Everything I’ve built has been shaped by what I was once denied. After years of developing methods and leading operations, I felt the need to focus on women’s issues. It wasn’t easy, but I knew I had to prepare myself. I established a professional support network, found mentors, and began investing in both knowledge and psychological well-being.
Verena (Meio): What’s DIVER.SSA focus?
Ítala: It was natural that most Afro-entrepreneurs were women. Many of the programs I led were aimed at supporting women, and I realized they required more focused attention. Together with my partner, Bia Bem, we discovered that these women needed both financial and network support, so I created a strategic support method based on three key pillars: Self-awareness, Self-confidence, and Self-management. DIVER.SSA was born as a company, an edtech (a company that combines technology and education to enhance learning), with a mission to be a platform for the mental and emotional well-being of women entrepreneurs.
Verena (Meio): How DIVER.SSA acts as an initiative?
Ítala: We launched a project with Itaú, focusing on Black women from the North and Northeast regions of Brazil, as well as Indigenous women, offering psychological and emotional support. We were pioneers, inspiring other movements to follow suit. We developed a success measurement model specifically for these women. DIVER.SSA has recently undergone a restructuring with new leadership, focusing on transferring wealth and transforming lives. We don’t accelerate businesses, we accelerate women. DIVER.SSA continues to grow and strengthen its foundation.
Verena (Meio): How do design and technology contribute to DIVER.SSA?
Ítala: I have always believed in having a designer by my side to make things possible. We tested the method with women and got input to prioritize. Designer Samille Sousa was one of those professionals who supported us a lot in structuring our tools. Design is what we need, but we don't know what it is. We need to connect the right people with those who have already done incredible things. We need to test, prototype, and listen to people.
Let’s talk about design
Verena (Meio): What’s your take on design?
Ítala: A good designer needs to know how to prototype, conduct research, and have a solid understanding of the realities they’re working with. The focus should always be on the problem, not the solution. You need to drink the juice of Brazil, immersing yourself in the context. The role of a designer is to solve a problem. Innovation is about solving a problem, not just being original for the sake of it. The most successful ideas come from people who know how to simplify things.
Verena (Meio): That reminds me of a quote by Uri Levine, co-founder of Waze: "Fall in love with the problem, not the solution." He even wrote a book around this idea. Now circling back, how can we use design for good?
Ítala: When we connect design to a movement with clear commitments, the benefits are undeniable. We must take full ownership of these tools. It’s crucial to acknowledge those who may not have formal education but are still essential. Design is about prioritization, about truly understanding people and their context. In the end, it's all about falling in love with the problem, not the solution.
“You need to drink the juice of Brazil, immersing yourself in the context. The role of a designer is to solve a problem. Innovation is about solving a problem, not just being original for the sake of it. The most successful ideas come from people who know how to simplify things.”
- Ítala Herta
What is the middle way?
Verena (Meio): What's the middle path for you?
Ítala: The middle path refers to a functional and practical place, an instrument that transcends, existing to unite, enable, consolidate, or spread. It's a useful space for this agenda.
Verena (Meio): It's what we say here, using technology and design as means to an end.
“It's what we say here, using technology and design as means to an end.”
Verena (Meio)